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Ep. 49. The Seeker of Untruth Returns: An exploration into whether suffering is inevitable

Rafael and Jim interview Andre Decary

Andre Decary, “The Seeker of Untruth,” returns for another stellar discussion, this time about his new writing project. In this episode, Andre makes an important distinction between pain and suffering. He references Jung and Einzelganger’s work to illustrate his point: “Pain is inevitable, but suffering is optional.” 

There is the Buddhist story of the two arrows that come toward you on the mountain path. When the first arrow hits, you know it hurts. Worse still, in the distance, you see a second arrow coming your way. Will you avoid it or let it hit you? How will you respond?  

The second arrow represents your reaction to the first arrow. The piercing of the first arrow is inevitable, while the second arrow presents an opportunity. Andre conveyed how by the time the second arrow comes your way you have more experience. And you have a choice. You can respond as you did to the first one, and experience suffering. Or you can opt to respond with hope or joy, or dodge it altogether. Andre references this story to distill the difference between pain and suffering. He discusses how we can be injured by someone’s words and actions (the first stinging arrow). However, we can learn to anticipate the second arrow and respond differently (which can give us hope). Nothing can change the fact we got hit by the first arrow that caused us inevitable pain or what Buddhists call “Duhkha.” But we can chose how we respond to the subsequent arrows we encounter on our path.

Andre also makes another important distinction in this podcast. He describes the difference between intimacy and closeness. Part of this distinction involves the calibration of vulnerability, self-awareness, differentiation, and empathy. Andre explores how couples can work on both closeness and intimacy. When you have both it is optimal. Tune in to the podcast to hear how — just by discussing these themes — we experienced closeness and professional intimacy.